High dose melatonin

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
I remember reading a few studies years ago of how high dose melatonin increased immune function. I think it was 20mg plus per night??

I have used these doses on occasions but not consistently. Anyone tried this long term and had immune function improve?

Im unsure of what parts of immune system improved either. Maybe its strong antioxidant effects help reduce inflammation?? ?
 

Who Me?

Well-Known Member
I read that too but not where. I tried 20 mgs. I was wasted the next day and still didn't sleep great.

There is also some side effect to melatonin. I can remember what but it was why I stopped it. I'll see if I can find it.
 

Paw

Well-Known Member
I wish someone would come up with the definitive word on melatonin. Not just the dosages, but whether it's harmful, etc.

But I've never try that high of a dose.
 

Remy

Administrator
Have fun, @Strike me lucky! ;)

From 2/17/16, Jack Kruse's blog.

https://www.jackkruse.com/the-dark-knight/

SUMMARY
So you read this monster and you’re thinking I am going out and taking melatonin. Not so fast. Taking melatonin orally chronically without blocking blue light can lead to eye damage. This eye damage will cause you to get all the diseases we see in the modern world. Yep………I said it and went there. This is where the foundation of modern disease is being generated in my opinion. All exogenous doses produce the same response. If our cells make it…….you’re not designed to take it. Hyperlink.

And here is more data to back up that bombshell. Hyperlink. No dose is safe with blue light. Although melatonin is present in food such as fruit, vegetables, and wheat, melatonin ingested with a normal diet does not significantly contribute to circulating levels. So why would anyone try to sell it in a pill? Money…….that is the only reason. Be smarter. Don’t let marketing distinguish anything. The first casualty in marketing is always the truth. Do your own biohacks to get your own conclusions. If you use melatonin you might be destroying the only quantum computer ever made, your brain. The miracle of your brain’s quantum physiology isn’t that you can see the world as it is. It’s that you can see the world as it isn’t.

Light responses in bipolar cells are initiated by synapses with photoreceptors. The bipolar cells then transmit the signals from the photoreceptors or the horizontal cells, and pass it on to the ganglion cells directly or indirectly via amercing cells in the retina. Unlike most neurons, bipolar cells communicate via graded potentials and not action potentials. This means light frequency is on a slope. That slope is related in quantum fashion to the neurotransmitters in the brain. All NT are also quantized to light. This is why dopamine and UV light are linked. Like horizontal cells, amacrine cells work laterally also. However, horizontal cells are connected to the output of rod and cone cells. These are the main photoreceptor of the eye clock and camera. Amacrine cells affect the output from bipolar cells directly (they are inhibitory), and are therefore more specialized. The specialization comes in the form of light frequencies they respond too. Each type of amacrine cell releases one or several NT’s where it connects with other cells in the brain to do what they do. This is why there are 33 types. If you understand factorial math, that means within our octave of the visible spectrum amacrine cells can handle
8,683,317,618,811,886,495,518,194,401,280,000,000 different frequencies. So when you realize that biochemistry only uses 100,000 reactions per second light frequencies can easily handle this task via your retina. A biochemist should recoil at the leverage of the power of light to control every aspect of biochemistry. Biochemists have no clue what controls enzymatic flux but now you do. “Let there be light” was no bullshit story.

This is how sorting out the visible spectrum of light occurs. We operate in just one octave of 73 octaves of light total spectrum. The visible spectrum of the sun is one octave!!!! How nuts is that!!!! Within that one octave are hundreds of thousands of frequencies of light. Amacrine cells determine what frequencies we pay most attention to and link them to neurotransmitters like serotonin, dopamine, melanin, melatonin, acetylcholine, GABA, carotenoids that respond to these frequencies. They are respond in quantized fashion controlled by light alone. The rest of the frequencies we remain oblivious too in our retina because our visual sense is not attuned to them. Do you hear radio stations if the dial is not tuned to them? No……..but do those radio stations still exist? Yep. Same thing with your eye. If humans create light we ain’t supposed to see at night can you see how this ruins EVERYTHING?

Everything we put on our bodies distorts our sensory perception. This alters our reality. I look at diseases as alternative realities now because of this blog. The senses are specific to our morphologic development and present for us to use the specific spectrum of our local environment in the best ways ways possible. When you move away from your ideal adapted environment things change. Why? Blocking one part of the spectrum alters biochemistry because it often regulates another. This is akin to having sex with your clothes on. We can do this, but nature wants us naked for a reason. Moreover, it’s probably not a good thing to consider. Mother Nature perspective is the one makes the point we should adhere to. Our surfaces are designed to decipher wave forms from the space around us; they are invisible to us unless we have our senses intact. If you take melatonin pills you destroy the circadian sense and the gears in your eye clock.

We don’t need to improve sleep with drugs……..we need to innovate darkness and sleep comes naturally as a result. Big difference. The inconceivable waves of light are everywhere but your eye is only attuned to a very specific octave of the spectrum. Focus in on what matters and not on what doesn’t. Nothing improves sleep like sunlight prescribed at the correct time during the day when UVA works its magic with neuropsin. How many times do you fall asleep at the beach? Now you might begin to realize why. When you embrace the sun, now, becomes most powerful aspect of your being and then it’s the dark’s turn to be afraid. Try not to be afraid because it shortens our time on Earth. Without the sun, our life becomes a series of fears fed by a series of chronic illnesses. When you become afraid, you become a book that no one reads. You become music that no one listens to anymore. You’ll become so afraid of fears that you’ll be abandoned like a movie playing in an empty theater. That is what burying the sun does to you. Dopamine and Melatonin are key gears in the biology of time.
 

Remy

Administrator
@Remy I will disagree with this



yes we do.
His point is that if we follow Mother Nature, we won't need to improve sleep with drugs because it will naturally be good.

If you are ill, by his definition you are out of sync with light cycles and sleep meds (including melatonin) mask but ultimately exacerbate the problem. We know that sleep meds destroy sleep architecture further. This has been well documented over the years.

I believe he is right but at the same time know how crucial sleep...or even the illusion of sleep is. It's kind of hard to tell people to throw away their sleep meds (even when you know they are doing harm) when you don't have any real, good solutions to offer in place other than seeing sun in the AM and blocking the blue after dark.
 

Cort

Founder of Health Rising and Phoenix Rising
Staff member
I would be careful with high dose melatonin. Melatonin is a hormone I believe. Some doctors - a minority I am sure - think it should be prescribed not over the counter because of that.
 

Who Me?

Well-Known Member
I would be careful with high dose melatonin. Melatonin is a hormone I believe. Some doctors - a minority I am sure - think it should be prescribed not over the counter because of that.
Then you'd have to add DHEA, Pregnenolone, OTC progesterone to the list. I'm sure there's more I'm forgetting.

I remember a CFS doc saying take that amount
 

Who Me?

Well-Known Member
@Remy I've had sleep problems long before I got sick. Even as a kid I remember having problems. I'd be happy if it was as simple for me as blocking blue light and the sun waking me.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Ive been using blue blockers for awhile, i cant say its helped sleep. I cant say melatonin helps sleep very much either. Our bodies are out of sync from cfsme , i think its impossible for our bodies to get in sync with nature etc until we can fix cfsme. Until then we are always fighting against our dysfunctional bodies, sleep issues, fatigue, pain etc.

I wasn't really interested to know if melatonin helped sleep but if it could help improve immune function.
 

Remy

Administrator
Ive been using blue blockers for awhile, i cant say its helped sleep. I cant say melatonin helps sleep very much either. Our bodies are out of sync from cfsme , i think its impossible for our bodies to get in sync with nature etc until we can fix cfsme. Until then we are always fighting against our dysfunctional bodies, sleep issues, fatigue, pain etc.

I wasn't really interested to know if melatonin helped sleep but if it could help improve immune function.
Chicken or the egg? Maybe getting back in sync with nature will fix MECFS too? Certainly that is the gist of a lot of what I've been reading lately.

The whole essay is about how taking melatonin wallops the immune system at any dose leading to all the diseases of the modern world including insomnia. The sleep stuff was incidental to his main point.

Anyway, it's Kruse. Take him or leave him. :)
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Chicken or the egg? Maybe getting back in sync with nature will fix MECFS too? Certainly that is the gist of a lot of what I've been reading lately.

The whole essay is about how taking melatonin wallops the immune system at any dose leading to all the diseases of the modern world including insomnia. The sleep stuff was incidental to his main point.

Anyway, it's Kruse. Take him or leave him. :)

I havent read anything of his lately, some of his stuff makes sense and other stuff seems way out there.
Melatonin is one of those things of who to believe, some say it helps immunity and others say not to use melatonin. Whats one to do. Most just guess or trial and error??
 

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