Low Fat Diet Helps Mitochondrial Disease

[Empty]

Hi,

In the past I have come across studies saying low fat diet helps mitochondrial diseases (animal based diet i think).

Does anyone have the links?

thanks.

 

[Empty]

This is not it but had not seen it before:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25757754

It is well known that few weeks of high fat (HF) diet may induce metabolic disturbances and mitochondrial dysfunction in skeletal muscle. However, little is known about the effects of long-term HF exposure and effects on brain mitochondria are unknown. Wistar rats were fed either chow (13E% fat) or HF diet (60E% fat) for 1 year.

The HF animals developed obesity, dyslipidemia, insulin resistance, and dysfunction of isolated skeletal muscle mitochondria: state 3 and state 4 were 30% to 50% increased (P<0.058) with palmitoyl carnitine (PC), while there was no effect with pyruvate as substrate. Adding also succinate in state 3 resulted in a higher substrate control ratio (SCR) with PC, but a lower SCR with pyruvate (P<0.05). The P/O2 ratio was lower with PC (P<0.004). However, similar tests on isolated brain mitochondria from the same animal showed no changes with the substrates relevant for brain (pyruvate and 3-hydroxybutyrate).

Thus, long-term HF diet was associated with obesity, dyslipidemia, insulin resistance, and significantly altered mitochondrial function in skeletal muscle. Yet, brain mitochondria were unaffected. We suggest that the relative isolation of the brain due to the blood-brain barrier may play a role in this strikingly different phenotype of mitochondria from the two tissues of the same animal

 

[Remy]

I don't think it is "well known" at all that a high fat diet adversely affects mitochondria. In fact, the treatment for many mitochondrial origin disorders is often a ketotic diet. Ketosis is beneficial because you can produce up to 30% more ATP over glucose. 30% more energy is a Big Deal when you are talking about chronic fatigue states.

I don't know what else the nice were eating in their chow but I do know that murine nutrition models have lots of problems when trying to extrapolate the results to humans. Plus other studies have shown opposite results...http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/22140436/?i=5&from=/25757754/related

Eating a ketotic diet has been one of the very best interventions I've ever made. The energy difference truly is staggering.

 

[Empty]

Just to apologise for getting cut off mid post leaving a block of text not in quotes. Thanks for baring with me whilst I edit...

Ur post looks interesting @Remy. Will read that next.

 

[Empty]

I don't think it is "well known" at all that a high fat diet adversely affects mitochondria. In fact, the treatment for many mitochondrial origin disorders is often a ketotic diet. Ketosis is beneficial because you can produce up to 30% more ATP over glucose. 30% more energy is a Big Deal when you are talking about chronic fatigue states.

I don't know what else the nice were eating in their chow but I do know that murine nutrition models have lots of problems when trying to extrapolate the results to humans. Plus other studies have shown opposite results...http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/22140436/?i=5&from=/25757754/related

Eating a ketotic diet has been one of the very best interventions I've ever made. The energy difference truly is staggering.

My first thought too was 'is it well known'? The study was published in 2015, so maybe things have progressed?

Is 45% fat really HF? What percentage in calories of fat do u eat @Remy to achieve your results?

 

[Remy]

My first thought too was 'is it well known'? The study was published in 2015, so maybe things have progressed?

Is 45% fat really HF? What percentage in calories of fat do u eat @Remy to achieve your results?

I don't actually know!

I just go by my blood ketone meter to make sure I'm staying in good ketosis. If my numbers drop, then I up the fat til they go back up.

Sorry that wasn't very helpful in terms of macros...

 

[Veet]

Here'sa recent article/podcast from Chris Masterjohn about ketogenesis. I haven't listened yet, looks good.

Many people think of carbohydrate and insulin as central to ketogenesis, but the direct biochemical event that initiates ketone formation is actually the oversupply of acetyl groups to the TCA cycle during conditions of oxaloacetate depletion.
While largely a biochemistry lesson, in this episode I also teach you the practical implications of this. There is more than one route to ketogenesis, and while they all produce ketones, they are fundamentally different in important ways.

 

[inkyford]

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Remy]

Here'sa recent article/podcast from Chris Masterjohn about ketogenesis. I haven't listened yet, looks good.

I've listened to this twice now. And I'm still confused about oxaloacetate. None of this is simple!

 

[Empty]

o Glad you said that @Remy. Ha ha I was thinking it. Thanks @Veet also.

I am getting swamped.

This was not a clickbait title so I will post when I find the studies. I think they maybe behind a paywall.

There is a book "a challenging second opinion" and it looks like mcdougall is going to go into it a bit each week on his youtube channel - he states he has not had to update too much since writing it but has kept up-to-date.

https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/shopping/ebooks/mcdougalls-medicine-a-challenging-second-opinion/

 

[Cort]

I don't actually know!

I just go by my blood ketone meter to make sure I'm staying in good ketosis. If my numbers drop, then I up the fat til they go back up.

Sorry that wasn't very helpful in terms of macros...

What is a blood ketone meter? Can you share? I didn't know such a thing exists...

I'm just eating lots of vegies, proteins and fats - staying away from grains and of course all sweets. Eating some sweet potatoes and potatoes occasionally.

I do notice a nice uptick - its been about three weeks...nothing spectacular but I'm definitely not going back to the old diet.

 

[Remy]

What is a blood ketone meter? Can you share? I didn't know such a thing exists...

I'm just eating lots of vegies, proteins and fats - staying away from grains and of course all sweets. Eating some sweet potatoes and potatoes occasionally.

I do notice a nice uptick - its been about three weeks...nothing spectacular but I'm definitely not going back to the old diet.

This is the one I have...

https://www.abbottdiabetescare.com/precision-xtra

I also have a Ketonix breath stick. That is more expensive up front but it doesn't require the pricey ketone test strips. In the end, it's probably much less expensive. However, I don't use it very much because the interface is not very user friendly. I keep thinking I should sell it.

https://www.ketonix.com/index.php?lang=en