Muscarinic Antibody Research Planned

bobby

Well-Known Member
this study seems to be looking into the same antibodies as the German ME study from last year. There's a pretty substantial overlap between ME and POTS, so I think this could potentially become very interesting for us!

In a preliminary study on 16 POTS patients + 20 controls, over 87% of the POTS patients had these antibodies!
http://www.dysautonomiainternational.org/page.php?ID=240
Muscarinic receptors are part of the parasympathetic nervous system. When antibodies bind to these receptors, this may cause problems with parasympathetic nerve messaging, which can lead to dysautonomia symptoms. Muscarinic receptor antibodies have previously been associated with other forms of dysautonomia that may have an autoimmune basis, like Chagas disease, Sjogren's syndrome, and idiopathic tachycardia.

In a preliminary study of 16 POTS patients and 20 controls, Dr. Vernino's lab recently found that more than 87% of POTS patients had one or more of the muscarinic antibodies. The research team also found that M1 was associated with cognitive impairment ("brain fog") and M3 was associated with an abnormal QSART (a test that measures small fiber autonomic nerve function in the limbs). In the upcoming study, we hope to improve the method for measuring muscarinic antibodies, validate these findings, and obtain additional information by repeating this study on a larger group of POTS patients during the 2016 conference.
[bimg=400|no-lightbox]http://www.dysautonomiainternational.org/images/muscarinic123.jpg[/bimg]
 

Cort

Founder of Health Rising and Phoenix Rising
Staff member
this study seems to be looking into the same antibodies as the German ME study from last year. There's a pretty substantial overlap between ME and POTS, so I think this could potentially become very interesting for us!

In a preliminary study on 16 POTS patients + 20 controls, over 87% of the POTS patients had these antibodies!
http://www.dysautonomiainternational.org/page.php?ID=240

[bimg=400|no-lightbox]http://www.dysautonomiainternational.org/images/muscarinic123.jpg[/bimg]
That is a major finding! Thanks for posting this. If they can nail this down an autoimmune cause of POTS would be huge...

How interesting that infectious onset had very little to do with this. Usually I think they picture an infection setting off an autoimmune reaction but most people had gradual onset of POTS ...

Among these 16 POTS patients, only 3 reported preceding infection or viral prodrome before symptom onset. Most of the patients (68.8%) had gradual (>3 months) onset and progression of symptoms.
 

weyland

Well-Known Member
this study seems to be looking into the same antibodies as the German ME study from last year.
Same type I believe yes. The German study found elevated M3 and M4 autoantibodies specifically.

I really wish someone would do a study on orthostatic tachycardia specifically in ME patients. I don't like generalizing these POTS study results and applying them to ME. For me, I have pretty stereotypical ME and POTS, but my parasympathetic nerve is completely unaffected per autonomic testing. My sympathetic nerve pathway is the one that is damaged.
 

Hip

Well-Known Member
I this post I set up a table showing all the different autoantibodies that various studies have found in ME/CFS and related conditions such as POTS.

With this present study, we now know that all the following autoantibodies have been found in POTS:

Adrenergic receptor alpha 1

Adrenergic receptor beta 1
Adrenergic receptor beta 2

Muscarinic receptor M1
Muscarinic receptor M2
 

Hip

Well-Known Member
As mentioned further down in the PR post, if there are antibodies they are there for a reason to fight something.
That is not the way it works with autoantibodies. Autoantibodies = antibodies that target a part of your own body, rather than pathogens.

The presence of autoantibodies is generally considered to be a mistake made by the immune system, as the immune system is now attacking you, rather than the infections in your body.
 

Issie

Well-Known Member
I just hit wrong button and deleted above post instead of edit. Will retype thought below.

They have found that pathogens (Lyme and Protomyzoa Rehumatica) has been shown to get into the DNA of our cells. They think it can be passed on to unborn child and possibly spread with sex between partners. Some docs feel it can never be completely gotten rid of - we just learn to moderate and co exist with it. The immune system seems to accept it as own. Yet, it still causes unwanted illness.

However, there can be issues with proteins being perceived as foreign and then attacked by the immune system. Since it has gotten confused as to what is acceptable "self" and what is foreign - it can start to attack self. Eliminating what may not be properly identified, may decrease the possible perception of error. That's why my doc highly encourages his chronically ill patients to avoid animal proteins.

I recently went back to having a small amount of animal proteins and now my POTS and MCAS is back in a flare. I do think there is something to diet as a key. Back to being strict again, as I had great improvement being stricter.

Many times things we think of as symptoms are in fact compensatory responses. They should not be moderated with meds. As they may be the lessor of two evils.

Issie
 
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