NIH Stumbles: Asks ME/CFS Denier to Speak on Chronic Fatigue Syndrome

Merida

Well-Known Member
There is a very interesting clip on You Tube where Maurice Hilleman ( was head of Merck vaccine division at one point) is interviewed by Edward Shorter - maybe 20 or so years ago. It is about a 10 minute clip. Search for Maurice Hilleman Edward Shorter. One version is posted by 911truthncD.

It is of great interest that Hilleman and Shorter discuss the wild viruses that were present in the early polio vaccines. Hilleman detected SV 40 virus in the early Sabin vaccines, and ultimately gave a presentation at international meetings concerning the detection of nondetectable viruses - in the context of vaccine development. The presence of these wild primate viruses in the monkeys used for vaccine development were of great concern to Hilleman.

So, it is interesting that Shorter has been aware, for decades!!!, of the problem of using animal tissue for vaccine development due to the presence of viruses that are difficult to detect. Just 6 years ago pig circovirus DNA was found in the rotavirus vaccine that had already been given to millions of infants.
Circovirus virus in pigs causes severe immunosuppression and possible death. Please read all you can.

After thinking about this all day, and more reading, I have a strong intuitive feeling that Shorter knows more than we appreciate about the virus or viruses that may be responsible for the onset of CFS.

There has been much research ( i.e. Genetic manipulation) in potential biowarfare viruses and bacteria - both here and in other countries. Just last year a dangerous bacterium, Burkholderia pseudomallei, escaped from a high- security lab at Tulane. And what were they doing with this organism and how did it escape?

Read The River by Edward Hooper. Read the statement of Dr. William Thompson, lead CDC vaccine scientist on how the MMR vaccine data was manipulated ( in violation of research protocol) to show no cause
effect relationship between autism and MMR vaccine - when, in fact , there was a 300 plus percent increase in autism in MMR vaccinated black boys.

There is much we have not been told.
 

Cort

Founder of Health Rising and Phoenix Rising
Staff member
There is a very interesting clip on You Tube where Maurice Hilleman ( was head of Merck vaccine division at one point) is interviewed by Edward Shorter - maybe 20 or so years ago. It is about a 10 minute clip. Search for Maurice Hilleman Edward Shorter. One version is posted by 911truthncD.

It is of great interest that Hilleman and Shorter discuss the wild viruses that were present in the early polio vaccines. Hilleman detected SV 40 virus in the early Sabin vaccines, and ultimately gave a presentation at international meetings concerning the detection of nondetectable viruses - in the context of vaccine development. The presence of these wild primate viruses in the monkeys used for vaccine development were of great concern to Hilleman.

So, it is interesting that Shorter has been aware, for decades!!!, of the problem of using animal tissue for vaccine development due to the presence of viruses that are difficult to detect. Just 6 years ago pig circovirus DNA was found in the rotavirus vaccine that had already been given to millions of infants.
Circovirus virus in pigs causes severe immunosuppression and possible death. Please read all you can.

After thinking about this all day, and more reading, I have a strong intuitive feeling that Shorter knows more than we appreciate about the virus or viruses that may be responsible for the onset of CFS.

There has been much research ( i.e. Genetic manipulation) in potential biowarfare viruses and bacteria - both here and in other countries. Just last year a dangerous bacterium, Burkholderia pseudomallei, escaped from a high- security lab at Tulane. And what were they doing with this organism and how did it escape?

Read The River by Edward Hooper. Read the statement of Dr. William Thompson, lead CDC vaccine scientist on how the MMR vaccine data was manipulated ( in violation of research protocol) to show no cause
effect relationship between autism and MMR vaccine - when, in fact , there was a 300 plus percent increase in autism in MMR vaccinated black boys.

There is much we have not been told.
I loved The River - I don't think that its been validated but what a great read - wow...That's one of my top ten science books.
 

Michael Corbett

New Member
Thanks for helping to shine a light on this, @Cort. It's appalling to read what Shorter is touting and it's really sad that such mean-spirited individuals exist let alone get to present to the NIH. It's fairly obvious that even a successful treatment for CFS will not necessarily change Shorter's opinion. He could simply say that the patient is no longer a malingerer. He has nothing to lose from taking this position.

My colleague, Gerard Pereira and I would love to share some of our work with you. Most notably in this context that we can replicate the cardinal features of the disease in healthy rats—essentially proving that the diseases has nothing to do with choice! Personally, I think we should let Shorter make his pitch, and then permanently ‘shut him up’ with data!

Please get it touch with us if you would like to discuss our work in detail. We look forward to hearing from you.

Thank you for all you do!!
 

sharonklb

Active Member
So I don't have an answer for this myself, but something ALWAYS strikes me as interesting when these - 9/10 psychiatric or psychology type nay-sayers voice their opinion.

While I know 100% for certain that ME/CFS is not depression, if I were to "play along" with these people and say it were...

There's still a problem and it's this: if you ask most providers in mental health they will not tell you that people with depression are malingerers not deserving of disability benefits if they are sick and not improving. Most will support truly ill patients in seeking benefits if they need them on a mental health diagnosis alone.

Which is telling and fascinating- as you will almost always hear that [we don't deserve any benefits and just need therapy] from the "ME/CFS is just depression/psychiatric disturbance" crowd.

_______

So it strikes me that they are among the camp that is anti-welfare, and anti-recovery, anti-patient.

Wholly, 100%. This is about control. It's politically conservative (in the bad way) and I would be willing to bet these people are among those who believe no disabled people should be receiving benefits of any kind unless they are "100%" visibly disabled.

It is very interesting: these same people do not push for "biomarkers" in their own categories of illness-

Depression likely is biological for many many people, and yet they (this group of providers) don't push for biological explanations because their entire business profits off of diagnosis by symptoms- no tests confirm depression to those they hand out diagnoses to.

If you are so sure [ME/CFS = depression] - push to find a biomarker for depression. Then push to prove that people with ME/CFS have that biomarker.

But no, they want to replace what they assume is a "subjective" illness diagnosis with ANOTHER because they say so.

The problem is these people are in the behavioral camp of mental illness too- which is a problem for those whose mental illness is not behavioral (a majority). Plenty of those with mental illness do not have primarily behaviorally based illnesses - behavior may contribute, but it is not causal.

The book they use to diagnose here (DSM) is wholly subjective and often detrimental.

I could go on for miles on the harm caused by the DSM and how it pathologizes normal behaviors without additional criteria being met (gender nonconformity, grief, etc). Still it is just one way to diagnose.

It is so informal receiving a mental illness diagnosis today.

TL;DR: Outsider-gatekeepers on a power and control abuse wheel trip.


________



But finally there is another thing- if a psychiatrist ever talked to me as a patient this way even about my *just* mental illness- I would report them to an ethics board so fast their head would spin.

This is an inappropriate way to speak to any client/patient- mental health or physical or both. It is an ethical violation- no matter what. It's an abuse of power in a personal sense (one on one context) and an abuse of power on a group wide context as well.

It is inappropriate, childish, and unprofessional to act this way towards a group of sick people REGARDLESS if you FEEL the cause is psychological or physical.

And you know what is subjective? The way these psychiatric doctors - a medical field barely old enough to be based on science as they themselves point out - use FEELINGS to justify ABUSING patients.

If they're so "right" be patient and wait for the science to prove you right. If you advocate that nothing be done- you just prove you have something to hide and have ulterior motives - in this case: profit.

Well too bad, your field already is failing to provide adequate care to actually mentally ill people across the board. Don't add more patient burden off your SUBJECTIVE NON-MEDICAL FEELINGS.

I have had good and bad, believers and non believers, but my present GP, has virtually just let himself known as the "closet disbeliever"! After requesting a benefit letter, his secretary constantly made mistakes and the letters were returned 3 times for this to be handed to a panel including a judge. He obviously got pissed off about this and with many confirmations from other professionals on his system, his words began with " i do not wish to regurgitate your own words into this letter and i deal with medical information not benefits applications"! After many weeks of dealing with the stress and a decline in mental and physical conditions, this man, knowing i was virtually sucicidal and bed ridden with it all, sent those words. I of course, replied with a point by point retort and copied all the info he actually had on his computer BUT having no other GP's in the area with space on their lists, i am now left with a GP who basically does not give a toss! I encountered a psychiatrist and a neuropsychiatrist in the past couple of years, who were so bad, i removed myself from any CMHT involvement in the future....so basically, it is go it alone once again.
The lack of empathy and knowledge these people display daily, is life changing for many and a constant source of stress.
Incidentally, i never got a reply to my extensive dismissal and proven information, of his "opinion"!
 

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