Rifampin lyme, anyone?

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Interested to hear from anyone who has benefited from rifampin for lyme.

Its suppose to be useful for some coinfections but is mentioned by some lyme gurus as a cyst buster.

I have been doing well on an abx combo and recently swapped in a low dose rifampin, so with roxithromycin and bicillin currently. I have tried other cyst busters like flagyl and feel awful on it but not sure if die off or just react poorly to it which is common.

From what i have read tinidazole, a cyst buster is kinder then flagyl and rifampin less sides etc. So i have been on rifampin 300mg a day for 5 days, the last two days i think i have had die off symptoms. Not really fatigue or headaches but alot more general muscle pain, back pain with knots in shoulder blades. But im tolerating it for now. I do plan to try tinidazole at a later stage.

Anyone had similar muscle pain type die off with this abx??

Cheers
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Might be low cortisol and not a herx. Rifampin speeds cortisol clearance which puts the adrenals under strain if they are already not functioning optimally.
Interesting, didnt know that. So do u think adding hc will help? Already use dhea and for awhile with optimal levels.
 

Remy

Administrator
Also FWIW, I think that there are much better abx for Lyme unless you are specifically trying to hit bartonella.

Dr Jaller, LymeMD blog, says that we've been wrong about the three forms of Lyme, that there are really only spirochetes (rapidly dividing forms) and persisters (stationary forms). There is no L-form in his opinion and the cysts would be better termed as 'round bodies' which are also persister, stationary forms.

So the combination of rifampin with doxy (or possibly bicillin) brings out the persisters so that they can be killed but rifampin alone won't do the trick apparently.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Also FWIW, I think that there are much better abx for Lyme unless you are specifically trying to hit bartonella.

Dr Jaller, LymeMD blog, says that we've been wrong about the three forms of Lyme, that there are really only spirochetes (rapidly dividing forms) and persisters (stationary forms). There is no L-form in his opinion and the cysts would be better termed as 'round bodies' which are also persister, stationary forms.

So the combination of rifampin with doxy (or possibly bicillin) brings out the persisters so that they can be killed but rifampin alone won't do the trick apparently.
Trying rifampin as it seems easier to tolerate. Also many years ago had a 2 day prophalaxis as i was in contact with someone who had some other type of infection. I felt a great improvement of cfs symptoms.

Yeah the science if cysts etc i know is up in the air. I have read cyst and l form ate probably the same and bicillin and penicillin type meds were getting at the cyst forms, which arelike you say persister cells??

I dont have any testing to prove lyme etc just die off reactions to abx and improvement from others. A suspicious rash i had on my back for along time which responded to doxy. So im really winging it and its helping.
 

Issie

Well-Known Member
There are also herbals you can use. I was on doxy for almost 3 years - very low dose. Along with antimalarial herbs. You have to use enzymes to break down biofilms and time things correctly when you take things. I'm only using enzymes and herbals now and doing better than when I was on doxy. But the doxy helped at the time.

Issie
 

Issie

Well-Known Member
Also, don't forget to use probiotics away from the antibiotics or herbals. But do use them. You don't want to imbalance your gut ecology. Remember the immune system is in the gut too.

Issie
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
There are also herbals you can use. I was on doxy for almost 3 years - very low dose. Along with antimalarial herbs. You have to use enzymes to break down biofilms and time things correctly when you take things. I'm only using enzymes and herbals now and doing better than when I was on doxy. But the doxy helped at the time.

Issie

I was looking into cats claw but apparently its not allowed in australia but grape seed extract is available locally which i will add later on. When I'mfinished with abx i will probably stay on some herbal treatment.

Ive been on probiotics and or nilstat longer than abx, might be why ive never had any gut issues.

The scary thing seems to be cyst/persister cells as it seems that they are extremely hard to clear completely and many seem to relapse.
 

Issie

Well-Known Member
I was looking into cats claw but apparently its not allowed in australia but grape seed extract is available locally which i will add later on. When I'mfinished with abx i will probably stay on some herbal treatment.

Ive been on probiotics and or nilstat longer than abx, might be why ive never had any gut issues.

The scary thing seems to be cyst/persister cells as it seems that they are extremely hard to clear completely and many seem to relapse.
I've used cats claw, Neem, olive leaf and grapefruit seed extract. Also collodial silver. For awhile I used the liquid samento and Banderol. Now, I'm mostly using products from Supreme Nutrition. Along with various detoxes. I recently started MMS. That is causing some major herxing.
Issie
 

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