SARMs to build muscle and boost VO2 max?

Remy

Administrator
Ben Greenfield wrote about a class of compounds called SARMs the other day in a blog post titled Safe Use of Steroids.

One compound in particular, GW-501516, seems particularly suited for the ME/CFS population because it can help to improve endurance and recovery as well as build muscle.

The best part is that the SARMs seem to do this without the disruptive effects of using steroids like testosterone directly. This might be especially helpful for women who need help building muscle but are not looking so much for facial hair or body odor.

I'm interested in hearing from people that have taken these substances...and thinking about trying it myself in the future.

The only caveat seems to be that these are banned substances for athletes but since I'm not a competitive athlete (hahaha) that doesn't really seem to apply to us.

GW-501516, also known as “Cadarine” is touted among SARMs users as the ultimate performance enhancer. The nature of GW-501516 is that it has been linked to reversing metabolic irregularities in obese men who have been diagnosed pre-iabetic metabolic syndrome. That syndrome basically means there is too much glucose in the blood, and GW-501516 may have the potential to reverse this, serving as a potential solution for fat loss and insulin insensitivity.

Sure, we all want fat loss, but GW-501516 achieves this differently than severe calorie restriction or copious amounts of exercise, which can cause muscle loss. It’s a non-catabolic, which means GW-501516 has the potential to burn fat quickly, and it does so without negatively impacting the muscle.
Keep the muscle, burn the fat. Great idea.

GW-501516 may also attract folks who crave higher endurance and improved recovery. GW-501516 provides athlete users with an unsurpassed edge over others (which is – attention athletes who are still competing – one of the reasons why it was banned by the World Doping Association in 2009). GW-501516 has a unique ability to significantly increase VO2 max, or maximal oxygen uptake.

I know what you are thinking if you are a well-versed anabolic geek in a white lab coat: GW-501516 is not exactly a SARM. You are kind of right. It could technically be classified as more of a PPAR agonist – or peroxisome proliferator-receptor agonist – which means it plays a critical role in therapeutic instances to balance energy metabolism and inflammation. But no matter what you “classify” it as (which is a silly rabbit hole in my opinion) the fat loss and muscle preserving effects of GW-501516 are undeniable and have long been studied by the scientific and medical community.

Read more https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/2016/08/safe-alternatives-to-steroids/
 

Remy

Administrator
That's really interesting, @Seanko, but I don't come away from it with the idea that the tumor issue is really a large risk considering it only happened in mice using very large doses. Many drugs probably would have that risk.

"The recent WADA warning was therefore not prompted by recent findings of adverse human health effects per se, but rather the concern of the substance’s ready availability and abuse by athletes."

That said, this type of intervention is definitely for the people who are more comfortable being guineas.

It seems more likely that they want to scare people away from it for other reasons. Wonder if anyone is developing any other drugs that target PPAR delta instead? Off to google!
 

Seanko

Well-Known Member
Yes, drug companies are very wary of potential litigation due to side effects so will not take chances. There are safer compunds used in sports science which could be tested on PWME to see if they help metabolism.

Something I'm trying at the moment are Branched chain Amino acids (BCAA) & Creatine. Both occur naturally in the body and are used by athletes & body builders.

Examine: BCAAs
Examine: Creatine

The reason fro trying BCAAs is that they help get glucose to cells and Creatine helps store phosphor rich compounds in muscles which can be metabolised easily to create energy (it's also relativley cheap!)

I looked up BCAAs because Robert Naviaux's metabolomics paper mentioned paptients have descreased levels of BCAAs, especially men.

Naviaux: Metabolic features of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (go to page 5)

"Branch Chain Amino Acid Metabolic Intermediates Were Decreased. 2-Hydoxyisocaproic acid (HICA) is derived from alpha ketoisocaproic acid, the transamination product of leucine. HICA was decreased in both males and females with CFS. This is consistent with decreased gut absorption, increased renal excretion, increased mitochondrial oxidation, or a combination of the three. HICA has antibacterial and antifungal activity (33)."
 

Remy

Administrator
I have read three more times about SARMs in the past few days.

Charles Poliquin was interviewed on Bulletproof Radio recently and mentioned a few. Dave Asprey mentioned the article he wrote on them during the interview.

https://blog.bulletproof.com/sarms-increase-muscle-growth-200/

Tim Ferriss also mentions using SARMs in his new book, Tools of Titans.

I like that they are doing some of this research on the elderly because I think that population has more in common with MECFS than bodybuilders.

I think I am going to try RAD140 first, if for no other good reason than it is available on Amazon by a brand I recognize. It is meant to help with muscle wasting, protect brain cells, and be safe for women. At least according to the "research"...
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Im possibly going to try ostarine which is a sarm, soonish. Besides its anabolic effects on muscle it also can help heal bone and joint issues and generally exercise recover. Also aids fatloss if everything else is in order
 

Cort

Founder of Health Rising and Phoenix Rising
Staff member
Ben Greenfield wrote about a class of compounds called SARMs the other day in a blog post titled Safe Use of Steroids.

One compound in particular, GW-501516, seems particularly suited for the ME/CFS population because it can help to improve endurance and recovery as well as build muscle.

The best part is that the SARMs seem to do this without the disruptive effects of using steroids like testosterone directly. This might be especially helpful for women who need help building muscle but are not looking so much for facial hair or body odor.

I'm interested in hearing from people that have taken these substances...and thinking about trying it myself in the future.

The only caveat seems to be that these are banned substances for athletes but since I'm not a competitive athlete (hahaha) that doesn't really seem to apply to us.




Read more https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/2016/08/safe-alternatives-to-steroids/
Really interesting; if not this - I imagine that somethings going to come out of the metabolic field that will help.

I just talked with a company that's developed a really intriguing possible treatment for ME/CFS; interestingly they started out with developing it for muscle wasting disease - then looked at ME/CFS and decided it was a better fit. I'll have a blog out on it soon.
 

Upgrayedd

Active Member
I actually got my hands on some Ostarine a few weeks ago, after reading about SARMs on Dave Asprey's website. I haven't tried it yet, but I think I'm ready. Curious as everyone to find out if they live up to the hype.
 

Remy

Administrator
I got mine too but then got into my DCA experiment. I expect it will be some time before I try it, unfortunately, because I really want to give the DCA a fair shot in light of the Fluge and Mella study and Naviaux's work.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
I actually got my hands on some Ostarine a few weeks ago, after reading about SARMs on Dave Asprey's website. I haven't tried it yet, but I think I'm ready. Curious as everyone to find out if they live up to the hype.
I have heard there can be a difference between the products from different companies. Enhanced Athlete seems to be getting good raps.

I noticed they had a sarm thats good at increasing endurance, basically works on mitochondria and can increase their numbers. Its called cardarine. Below is from their website.

While Cardarine does not increase strength, it does provide quantifiable gains in stamina and endurance.

  • Resistance Exercise: Reduce rest time between sets, perform more sets at high intensity.
  • Cardiovascular Exercise: Immediately boost endurance. Running 10 miles will likely feel as taxing as running 2 miles without Cardarine.
  • General: Exercise harder for longer with substantially less fatigue and drastically improved recovery time.
  • Cardarine, (without a doubt) noticeably increases cardio performance. My personal research shows about a 50% increase within the first few days. Boost in cardiovascular performance is even more drastic for research subjects that are NOT in good physical/cardiovascular shape. Many users report doubling endurance. I personally see similar results from both 10mg and 20mg doses, so 10mg is my default dosage.
v2.enhancedathlete.com/
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Cardarine
GW-501516
GW-501516, better known as Cardarine, is a unique medication officially classified as a PPAR receptor agonist (PPAR-RA). Research for this medication began in 1992 in a conjoined effort between GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) and Ligand Pharmaceuticals. Research into this product was set forth in an effort to provide treatment for various cardiovascular diseases, as well as diabetes, obesity and other conditions. It was soon discovered that the PPAR-RA was highly effective at enhancing endurance, but it was also shown to carry a high potential cost. It was discovered that Cardarine increased the chances of cancer significantly, and as a result, GSK dropped all further research. However, the studies that produced cancerous results used doses of Cardarine that were 500 to even 1000 times the amount that a human being would take. If cancer is a risk with standard dosing is unknown.

Cardarine Functions and Traits

Cardarine (GW-501516) binds to the PPAR receptor, specifically a group of nuclear receptors (sensors that detect thyroid and steroidal hormones in the body) that initiates the PGC-1a enzyme. This action leads to gene expression, specifically genes that revolve around energy expenditure.

Studies involving GW-501516 have shown to increase the metabolism of fatty acids in rats. It was also shown in the same studies to reduce the odds of obesity despite poor eating habits as well as prevent Type-2 diabetes. Cardarine was also shown to increase HDL (good cholesterol) and decrease LDL (bad cholesterol) in a study using monkeys. The effects seemed to hold true with or without exercise.

Effects of Cardarine

The effects of Cardarine are fairly significant and may be a welcomed addition to the stack for a performance athlete. Increased endurance may be the PPAR-RA’s most incredible attribute. Those who use the medication will find they do not tire out as easily and can train harder and longer. The cardiovascular endurance that comes with Cardarine is so strong it has been shown to do away with the cardio issues that surround the popular anabolic steroid Trenbolone. Many who use Trenbolone report breathing becomes a bit more difficult and that cardio becomes a more arduous task. Cardarine seems to negate this negative effect when using Tren.

The effects of Cardarine also help tremendously with fat loss. If nothing else, you’re able to perform your cardio more intensely and longer. Further, it doesn’t carry any catabolic effect that is associated with many thermogenics or fat burners, meaning muscle loss due to use is of no concern. More importantly, GW-501516 has been shown to increase nutrient efficiency. Simply put, you make better use of the nutrients you’re consuming. Those who use the compound will find increased levels of glucose uptake and fat stores reduced.

Side Effects of Cardarine

The known side effects of Cardarine primarily surround increasing the chances of cancer; however, it’s not quite that cut and dry. Studies that showed increased cancer rates in rats used doses of the PPAR-RA far above and beyond what any human would take. Further, additional studies have shown GW-501516 decreased existing cancerous tumors and in effect cured the existing cancer. The truth behind the relationship with this drug and cancer is unknown at this time. Because there is a potential relationship between the medication and cancer, we may never know the truth as it’s unlikely any major pharmacy group will undertake any additional study.

Estrogenic: There are no estrogenic side effects associated with GW-501516. Water retention, bloating, gynecomastia and high blood pressure associated with water retention is not possible as there is no conversion of testosterone to estrogen.

Androgenic: The side effects of Cardarine do not include any of an androgenic nature. Hair loss, acne and virilization symptoms in women are not possible with this medication.

Cardiovascular: There are no negative side effects of Cardarine associated with cardiovascular health; in fact, lipids may improve. In a study done by the Journal of Cardiology, GW-501516 was stated to possibly reduce the risk of heart attack.

Testosterone Suppression: GW-501516 will not suppress natural testosterone production. Post Cycle Therapy (PCT) is not needed when using this PPAR-RA.

Hepatotoxicity: Cardarine is not toxic to the liver.

Cardarine Administration

GW-501516 is taken orally. The most common dosing range for this PPAR-RA is 10-15mg per day for 8 weeks. However, some reports state the medication needs to be used for 12 weeks for optimal results, with 20mg per day being well tolerated by most individuals.

Based on its positive attributes, Cardarine may be one of the single best products an athlete could buy. However, although not an anabolic steroid, numerous sporting bodies have already banned it and it will show up in sports doping tests. But when it comes to the benefits, endurance and enhancing nutrient efficiency are two benefits that are hard to beat. It’s hard to beat this into the head of many athletes, recovery, endurance and food itself are the three most important factors associated with making gains or improving performance, and Cardarine does just that.

Although the benefits of Cardarine are undeniable, we are still left with the glaring possibility of use-induced cancer. Regardless of how much muscle you carry or how low your body fat is, cancer is going to ruin the physique you’ve built, not to mention your life. The odds of cancer, from looking at some of the studies that were done they do appear to be somewhat flawed, while others scream warning. It is truly hard to say what would happen if you were to try this drug, but there does appear to be a legitimate risk, and enough of one to cause a very large pharmaceutical giant to completely give up on what could have been a highly profitable drug had the cancer scare not existed.
 

Lissa

Well-Known Member
Wow... it sure sounds like a miracle drug! The cancer warning is scary of course. It seems worth trying at low end doses though.

However, it makes me wonder if PWC are more susceptible to a "side effect" such as cancer, since we seem to be more likely to get cancer/lymphomas in the first place.

Sure would like to hear from someone who has tried it!
 

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