Herbal combo

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Order bulk herb powders and will cap them myself. Works out quite cheap. Hoping it improved mood and help immune system while i rest up.

So standard combo of astragalua, withania and siberian ginseng i will mix together and cap. And take a week off every so often.

Two other herbs echinacea and skullcap extract which i will cap individually. Echinacea cycle for 2 weeks on 1 week plus off. Skull cap havent decided as its used for sleep as well as having infection foghting effects.

Id like to eventually stop pregnenolone and dhea supps and atleast test levels off supplements.

Other thing i use are antioxidants. Plus prescription drugs for sleep abx and avs and inosine.

Recent blood work shows my b and t cells slightly high like im fighting an infection probably the vzv. Im using famvir 500mg three times a day.

Thats my plan pill wise. Need to work on very mild exercise once i feel better. Not that im anxious normally but want to be able to turn my brain off for naps and things.

Diet i want to be strict protein, low carbs . Maybe a beer at the rugby league cheeringmy team.

Anything else?
 

Who Me?

Well-Known Member
Can I ask how you know the dosage when you cap?

I've looked at capping myself but I've noticed that machines are for only one size cap.

Also seems like it might take more energy than I have

eBay has empty vegetarian caps in various sizes for those interested in the US. I think @Cort posted places to get bulk stuff.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Can I ask how you know the dosage when you cap?

I've looked at capping myself but I've noticed that machines are for only one size cap.

Also seems like it might take more energy than I have

eBay has empty vegetarian caps in various sizes for those interested in the US. I think @Cort posted places to get bulk stuff.
Some people buy scales and weigh them but size O caps generally hold around 500mg per cap, so thats what im working off. Can be a pain but it does work out cheaper. If you can handle the taste you could just mix it in water but i dont think i could handle the taste.
 

Who Me?

Well-Known Member
How do you know how much to put in? Doesn't that density make a difference?

Why not make tea? Very macho.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
How do you know how much to put in? Doesn't that density make a difference?

Why not make tea? Very macho.
Capping machines have a device that helps pack the capsules tight. Its only an approx but size zero caps are 500mg. Theres charts online that give approx doses on size of caps and density of powder to give a more accurate dosing but really only a difference of maybe 50mg. If one wants to be exact then people by the scales for measuring minute amounts. But with the herbals im using it doesnt really matter to be precise.

Astragalus Tea and scones maybe? With my pinky pointing out.
 

Cort

Founder of Health Rising and Phoenix Rising
Staff member
Order bulk herb powders and will cap them myself. Works out quite cheap. Hoping it improved mood and help immune system while i rest up.

So standard combo of astragalua, withania and siberian ginseng i will mix together and cap. And take a week off every so often.

Two other herbs echinacea and skullcap extract which i will cap individually. Echinacea cycle for 2 weeks on 1 week plus off. Skull cap havent decided as its used for sleep as well as having infection foghting effects.

Id like to eventually stop pregnenolone and dhea supps and atleast test levels off supplements.

Other thing i use are antioxidants. Plus prescription drugs for sleep abx and avs and inosine.

Recent blood work shows my b and t cells slightly high like im fighting an infection probably the vzv. Im using famvir 500mg three times a day.

Thats my plan pill wise. Need to work on very mild exercise once i feel better. Not that im anxious normally but want to be able to turn my brain off for naps and things.

Diet i want to be strict protein, low carbs . Maybe a beer at the rugby league cheeringmy team.

Anything else?
Who are you ordering the herbs from in bulk?

Looks like a nice plan....I'd like to turn my brain off too!
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Something else im going to try is dessicated liver tablets which is an old time bodybuilding trick to keep the body anabolic and improve energy as well as using free for amino acids which i will take 3 times a day between meals. This should also stabilizes my blood sugar levels and energy and keep plenty of aminos and protein in the body to recover and repair.

Cfsme is a very catabolic illness ie breaks it down the body including alot of muscle mass. Hopefully this can also help improve my cfs with plenty of rest. Also has indirect effects on immune function.

So far all these treatments i can find cheap many in bulk forms.

So far everything in this thread ive partially tried before but while i was still working and running my body into the ground. Always missing the important ingredient, rest.

Looks good on paper but we will see???
 

Seven

Well-Known Member
Echinacea
If I take this, I crash for days (is an immune booster) so you have to start low and increase slow. How are you going to know if u have a problematic herb? I like the idea but I guess I would first try them individually and increase slow then put them together if not issue. This is more for a newby I know you knwo the drill.
 

Tammy7

Well-Known Member
Something else im going to try is dessicated liver tablets which is an old time bodybuilding trick to keep the body anabolic and improve energy as well as using free for amino acids which i will take 3 times a day between meals. This should also stabilizes my blood sugar levels and energy and keep plenty of aminos and protein in the body to recover and repair.
Are you taking just certain amino's or an all around basic formula? I think amino acids are important also. I used to take Montiff's amino acids which is Don Tyson's company . Don used to lecture all over about the importance of amino acid therapy.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
If I take this, I crash for days (is an immune booster) so you have to start low and increase slow. How are you going to know if u have a problematic herb? I like the idea but I guess I would first try them individually and increase slow then put them together if not issue. This is more for a newby I know you knwo the drill.
I have taken all the herbals before at some stage or another with no problems. Echinacea ive used in high doses for colds. Im lucky in that i dont have alot of sensitivities , yet.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
Are you taking just certain amino's or an all around basic formula? I think amino acids are important also. I used to take Montiff's amino acids which is Don Tyson's company . Don used to lecture all over about the importance of amino acid therapy.

My plan is dessicated liver tablets which are high in many nutrients and protein. And a slow release amino acid formula.

Vince gironda was a famous bodybuilding trainer in the 1950s/60s/70s and a big proponent of liver tablets and high protein and lowcarb diets. These guys were good with nutrition before steroids were commonly used.
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
So all my bulk herbs arrived awhile back. So have been capping them between good spells of headaches.

Astragalus 500mgx2 am pm
Echinacea 500mg am pm
Withania 500mg pm
Baicilin 500mg pm
Siberian ginseng i will add soon at 500mg am once i finish short pred course and stabilize on duloxetine for pain.

My liver tabs and aminos havent arrived yet but i have bulk powder okg which is an anabolic amino that i take 2 to 3 times during the day between meals.

Also to try and help nerve pain heal with shingles ive been doing high dose b12 shots and today started a fat soluble form of b1 called benfotiamine i had sitting in the cupboard. Its used for neuropathies. In the past after a few days i felt over stimulated on this as i think it may build up so im goingbto take every third day off.

Cheers
 

RuthAnn

Well-Known Member
@Strike me lucky , in the "other" rising forum there was a thread about unfolded protein response and while reading there I realized that some viruses actually rely on unfolded protein response and the heat shock proteins that it causes. I know I found very specific information about that with respect to EBV and it's actually been the best way for reducing symptoms. Makes sense to me.

This study talks about heat shock protein90 (HSP90) and it's implications in virus replication. HZV isn't mentioned specifically but I did find the tie in to it in another study which I will link later.

I am not recommending the use of the drugs that they talk about. I am only suggesting that reducing the unfolded protein response and thus reducing stimulation of heat shock proteins might be a good strategy for shingles.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0167488911003090
Broad action of Hsp90 as a host chaperone required for viral replication
 

Strike me lucky

Well-Known Member
@Strike me lucky , in the "other" rising forum there was a thread about unfolded protein response and while reading there I realized that some viruses actually rely on unfolded protein response and the heat shock proteins that it causes. I know I found very specific information about that with respect to EBV and it's actually been the best way for reducing symptoms. Makes sense to me.

This study talks about heat shock protein90 (HSP90) and it's implications in virus replication. HZV isn't mentioned specifically but I did find the tie in to it in another study which I will link later.

I am not recommending the use of the drugs that they talk about. I am only suggesting that reducing the unfolded protein response and thus reducing stimulation of heat shock proteins might be a good strategy for shingles.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0167488911003090
Broad action of Hsp90 as a host chaperone required for viral replication

Sounds interesting but whats and hsp90 inhibitor exactly, where do you find them and what other name could they be called??
 

RuthAnn

Well-Known Member
Actually, what inhibits heat shock protein is keeping your protein folding area of your cells in a low stress state or relieving any stress that there may be going on.

Arginine is the only thing that I know of that actually inhibits heat shock protein, and that might be why it's good for EBV. It does, however, activate herpes simplex, so it's not so easy as taking something.

I don't know if lysine might inhibit heat shock protein because it surely does help with viral symptoms.

Oh, I just remembered that taurine and beta alanine are very helpful.

@Croatoan might know a different way to look at it that can help from a different angle.
 

Croatoan

Well-Known Member
Actually, what inhibits heat shock protein is keeping your protein folding area of your cells in a low stress state or relieving any stress that there may be going on.

Arginine is the only thing that I know of that actually inhibits heat shock protein, and that might be why it's good for EBV. It does, however, activate herpes simplex, so it's not so easy as taking something.

I don't know if lysine might inhibit heat shock protein because it surely does help with viral symptoms.

Oh, I just remembered that taurine and beta alanine are very helpful.

@Croatoan might know a different way to look at it that can help from a different angle.
Funny, I just started a thread on psoriasis that might be kind of linked to this.

Lysine is created in the Biotin cycle by the biotinidase gene:

[bimg=600|no-lightbox]https://www.peds.ufl.edu/divisions/genetics/_style/images/Metabolic%20diagrams/Biotin-cycle-drawn-white.jpg[/bimg]

Note that Biotin will degrade Acetyl COA with the enzyme ACACA. why is this important? The less Acetyl COA you make the less you will push the Urea cycle which might effect Arganine levels:

[bimg=600|no-lightbox]http://www.nature.com/gim/journal/v15/n4/images/gim2012166f3.gif[/bimg]
 

RuthAnn

Well-Known Member
Note that Biotin will degrade Acetyl COA with the enzyme ACACA. why is this important? The less Acetyl COA you make the less you will push the Urea cycle which might effect Arganine levels
Does this mean that the less Acetyl CoA you make you will have elevated levels of arginine?
Arginine really messes me up. Acetyl CoA is made from B5?

Thanks, very interesting. I have some bulk biotin and haven't been taking it because I've been lazy and it's not encapsulated.
I took some biotin that is encapsulated but I think it contains a yeast, which might be the excess flaking skin on my eyes this morning, IDK. (Either that or the amines in my salads yesterday???) I will switch to the clean biotin.
 

Croatoan

Well-Known Member
Does this mean that the less Acetyl CoA you make you will have elevated levels of arginine?
Arginine really messes me up. Acetyl CoA is made from B5?

Thanks, very interesting. I have some bulk biotin and haven't been taking it because I've been lazy and it's not encapsulated.
I took some biotin that is encapsulated but I think it contains a yeast, which might be the excess flaking skin on my eyes this morning, IDK. (Either that or the amines in my salads yesterday???) I will switch to the clean biotin.
B5 is used as a cofcator to make Acetyl COA, but Acetyl COA really comes from too much food!
[bimg=600|no-lightbox]http://antranik.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/catabolism-of-proteins-and-fats-and-sugars.gif[/bimg]

for me, high fats would always cause my seb derm to flare up. That is just my specific issue, your genetics might be different.
 

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