Mikovits Still Believes XMRV is It!

Merida

Well-Known Member
Don't know ?? Anyone??? I am heading for the Retroviral Camp. But what if it is even more complex? My son at age 5 ( 1986) had definite EBV, but not elevated monocytes. Did someone insert retroviral genes into EBV, or the reverse????? EBV was certainly used in research with viruses with the potential to carry genes into the cell nucleus/ genome.
 

Seven

Well-Known Member
When I read thread like this, I really would like to clarify liability.
Businesses are to make profit. They will never admit to wrong doing or mistake because that makes them liable. Might not be moral but it is business sense.
If the vaccines are causing harm, they will never, ever, ever accept. So it is the patient responsibility to prove. So anybody that tries will be fought w all they got. They have money and way too much control. It is not a conspiracy, is basic business sense.
I don't know why it is so hard for plp to understand that. Is not personal to MECfs or any other indirect disgrace they have cause ( whoever if anybody).
So as a community, NOBODY will
Fight for you or have better interest to clarify than ourselves.
So we have to be open minded and use logic. Follow the science.
I don't know if she is right or wrong but the only question I have:
How we never had money for Cfs and all of the sudden they organize a study to deny retroviral XRMRV, organize a huge study and conclude sooooo fast, when we have to beg for money and anything to be taken seriously related to cfs. Why that got taken seriously! Tones of plp have said they have it ( Chia and retroviral) and they have not gone at it this intense. So all I ask why her?! Is not if she is even right or wrong for me. Was the reaction that calls my attention. And nobody can say it is not bizare.
Follow the money.
 

Merida

Well-Known Member
Well, then there is the viral research for gypsy moth control. 'They' engineered a baculovirus to be sprayed on gypsy months. Not only did the virus kill the moths, but it caused them to climb up the tree, die,nand rain viral particles on the other moths.

Baculoviruses are in dsDNA viral group - same group as human Herpes viruses. Jim Slavich, a U.S. Forestry biologist, commented, " Who knew that a virus would be able to change the behavior of its host." Others have commented that it is a "clever pathogen."

And and the "hustling" may be even more complex than we can imagine.
I should move the next part of this to my CFS X Files thread. I was watching Ancient Aliens one night ( on plagues? Ha! ) and who should be interviewed but MY doctor here in L.A. Ian Lipkin had some brief comments on the same show! ( memory failing). So I asked MY doc about this- he is double board certified( internal med and infectious disease, prof at local big university here). Did he think we had been exposed to viruses that came from off planet?? The answer was "Yes."

Next visit, "well, was this exposure accidental or on purpose??" Answer,
"I don't know. I don't know." I begged for more info. He just would not comment further.

It is also important to appreciate that those of us who are sick share certainly personality traits. I led large support group 13 years - saw this over and over again. We tend to be caring, kind - even to our own detriment- have a generous 'soul.' Many have psychic type gifts and Strong intuitive capabilities. Often there are other special gifts that run in these families.

Have you heard what Robert Bigelow ( owner of Bigelow Aerospace - a NASA contractor) said in a 20/20 interview 2 weeks ago?

Please appreciate that I did not arrive 'here' easily. I began original research in high school ( 1960s)?in conjunction with the Univ. of Pittsburgh - the teratogenic effects of chlorpromazine. I did the whole project myself at my high school - won awards in county and state. Went on to get a B.Sc. In biology/ multiple honors, early career in clinical diagnostic microbio, and so much more. I believed in the scientific method.

And now what and 20 years of being disabled ? May All that is Good and Strong and Beautiful be with us as we travel this Road. May we be blessed with the insight to see What? How? Who?
 
I knew Dr. Mikovits was talking about something but I didn't know that she believed XMRV was still a real problem.

She refused to destroy data? Who is ever asked to destroy data?

definitely this is the Result of an infectious disease, beyond any resanoble doubt, resulting in an immune deficiency.
when people hear immune deficiency they think of AIDS and people dying" mistake "
many people with hiv are heathy carriers that will never develope immune deficiency ( AIDS) why???
its not becouse the strain they have is diferent " its becouse their immune system is healthy and strong , their antiviral RnaseL antiviral is strong, exactly thesame thing happen to most of the population that get a virus like EBV, CMV, ,HSV1,2,VZS,HHV6...if your immune system is strong with strong RnaseL antiviral and healthy strong nk cell funtion ( CD56) is the answere... viral in signaling immune response them you have no problem, but if this part is impaired very much anything can cause me/cfs, not just me/cfs but other the diseases, mostly auto immune, neuro immune..this proof that you don't need HIV to develope an immune deficiency , if this part of your immune system is impaired defective the NK cells, the RnaseL antivirals thru a defective methyliation , and a low Cd56 funtion almost any virus can damage your cells, hhv6 can deplete cd4 lynphocytes just as much as hiv does, CMV, EBV.. once they enter the cell the all replicate un check, they pass to organs, to the peripheral nervous system. central nervous system causing all this inflamation that we see in me/cfs and all others neuro immune disease & auto immune disease, the inate immune system(nk cells cd56 bright) don't do the correct signaling so when the adaptive immune system kicks in to clear inflection already colonized in organs etc cause all this ineffective cytokine storm and all the inflamation.
This is the reason why the associate sooooo many pathogens to me/cfs but can not define one as the cause and still a multisytemic disease with out a single cause( the underlaying cause is the problem )
this is an infectious disease from whatever angle you look at it.
Im not sure if its Mikovits xmrv( mlv) related gamma retrovirus or a BLV delta Retrovirus or another Retrovirus.
but 100% this is a transmisible infectious disease most likely a Retrovirus that the action is on the inate immune system impairing the inate immune system not signaling something is wrong, that is also why cancer rates are so high in me/cfs.. not signaling properly not proper cytotoxic response ..
this is clear plain and simple everything else is call" COVER UP"
maybe this is the reason of the unexplained no research and all missleadings in ME/CFS.


 
Well, then there is the viral research for gypsy moth control. 'They' engineered a baculovirus to be sprayed on gypsy months. Not only did the virus kill the moths, but it caused them to climb up the tree, die,nand rain viral particles on the other moths.

Baculoviruses are in dsDNA viral group - same group as human Herpes viruses. Jim Slavich, a U.S. Forestry biologist, commented, " Who knew that a virus would be able to change the behavior of its host." Others have commented that it is a "clever pathogen."

And and the "hustling" may be even more complex than we can imagine.
I should move the next part of this to my CFS X Files thread. I was watching Ancient Aliens one night ( on plagues? Ha! ) and who should be interviewed but MY doctor here in L.A. Ian Lipkin had some brief comments on the same show! ( memory failing). So I asked MY doc about this- he is double board certified( internal med and infectious disease, prof at local big university here). Did he think we had been exposed to viruses that came from off planet?? The answer was "Yes."

Next visit, "well, was this exposure accidental or on purpose??" Answer,
"I don't know. I don't know." I begged for more info. He just would not comment further.

It is also important to appreciate that those of us who are sick share certainly personality traits. I led large support group 13 years - saw this over and over again. We tend to be caring, kind - even to our own detriment- have a generous 'soul.' Many have psychic type gifts and Strong intuitive capabilities. Often there are other special gifts that run in these families.

Have you heard what Robert Bigelow ( owner of Bigelow Aerospace - a NASA contractor) said in a 20/20 interview 2 weeks ago?

Please appreciate that I did not arrive 'here' easily. I began original research in high school ( 1960s)?in conjunction with the Univ. of Pittsburgh - the teratogenic effects of chlorpromazine. I did the whole project myself at my high school - won awards in county and state. Went on to get a B.Sc. In biology/ multiple honors, early career in clinical diagnostic microbio, and so much more. I believed in the scientific method.

And now what and 20 years of being disabled ? May All that is Good and Strong and Beautiful be with us as we travel this Road. May we be blessed with the insight to see What? How? Who?
i re
I don't have a problem with research of retroviruses into ME/CFS, but I don't think it will prove to be the cause.

If retroviruses are investigated, I don't want Mikovits anywhere near the research.
it wont as long as the research is funded paid and guided by thesame people that have being covering up and deniying me/cfs for decades..
this looks feel Retroviral and infectious disease from every alngle you look at it.
i would like to know whith what base you refer yourself like that to say you don't want mikovits any were near a retroviral research ??
contaminant???
come on that woman its fighting hard to bring this human mascre to light!! everything she say make 100% perfect sense feom every stand point, biology, cellular leven, immune, everything and everything fits to our body disfuntions what happen to most of us.
definitely this is the Result of an infectious disease, beyond any resanoble doubt, resulting in an immune deficiency.
when people hear immune deficiency they think of AIDS and people dying" mistake "
many people with hiv are heathy carriers that will never develope immune deficiency ( AIDS) why???
its not becouse the strain they have is diferent " its becouse their immune system is healthy and strong , their antiviral RnaseL antiviral is strong, exactly thesame thing happen to most of the population that get a virus like EBV, CMV, ,HSV1,2,VZS,HHV6...if your immune system is strong with strong RnaseL antiviral and healthy strong nk cell funtion ( CD56) is the answere... viral in signaling immune response them you have no problem, but if this part is impaired very much anything can cause me/cfs, not just me/cfs but other the diseases, mostly auto immune, neuro immune..this proof that you don't need HIV to develope an immune deficiency , if this part of your immune system is impaired defective the NK cells, the RnaseL antivirals thru a defective methyliation , and a low Cd56 funtion almost any virus can damage your cells, hhv6 can deplete cd4 lynphocytes just as much as hiv does, CMV, EBV.. once they enter the cell the all replicate un check, they pass to organs, to the peripheral nervous system. central nervous system causing all this inflamation that we see in me/cfs and all others neuro immune disease & auto immune disease, the inate immune system(nk cells cd56 bright) don't do the correct signaling so when the adaptive immune system kicks in to clear inflection already colonized in organs etc cause all this ineffective cytokine storm and all the inflamation.
This is the reason why the associate sooooo many pathogens to me/cfs but can not define one as the cause and still a multisytemic disease with out a single cause( the underlaying cause is the problem )
this is an infectious disease from whatever angle you look at it.
Im not sure if its Mikovits xmrv( mlv) related gamma retrovirus or a BLV delta Retrovirus or another Retrovirus.
but 100% this is a transmisible infectious disease most likely a Retrovitus.
como on make sense of what i just said and everything she is saying in her book, in her seminars, the world out there is listening to her, obviously not CDC, not FDA, but its more than clear to who this group of gov instituions represent and its not us, not sick, not the ill not science, they only back up the science that will make those elite groups more profit, she is risking her life, couse all that is against goverment is against big pharma , we all know what happen to people that threat to expouse this people and threat their profits.
who do you want close to the research ?? CDC, lipkin? nih?? the people that have denied and blind misslead is for decades???
 

Merida

Well-Known Member
@ariane lamo
I thought this all of this illness was due to problems with structure and function until I was diagnosed recently ( by standard U.S. Labs) with active Lyme ( one tick bite 2010), active mycoplasma, active Clamydophila pneumoniae, active EBV. And it is interesting that most everyone has been exposed to these common organisms, with the exception of the Lyme bacteria. Though these Lyme numbers are becoming huge.

However, only a certain group seem to get ill? And the group is mostly women. Let's hope a 'whistleblower' steps forward.
 
@ariane lamo
I thought this all of this illness was due to problems with structure and function until I was diagnosed recently ( by standard U.S. Labs) with active Lyme ( one tick bite 2010), active mycoplasma, active Clamydophila pneumoniae, active EBV. And it is interesting that most everyone has been exposed to these common organisms, with the exception of the Lyme bacteria. Though these Lyme numbers are becoming huge.

However, only a certain group seem to get ill? And the group is mostly women. Let's hope a 'whistleblower' steps forward.
jajaja many whistleblower have stepped foward, but they are either dead or with the life's ruined.
its not only mikovits many other brilliant Dr and hiv cancer researchers have suffered that faith.
ofcourse its not the tick bite the problem none of those pathogens are cronic issues unless you have a deficiency impaired immune system like the one people with cfs, cronic lyme, fibro etc.. have ..the low immunity its what cause all this pathogens even gut bad bacteria to overgrow, lymers like cfs'ers have all kind of infections viral and bacterial ...
retroviruses , infectious desease " a person of average intelectual can see it, no need to be rocket scientist to see it.
not everyone develope cronic severe me/cfs, many develope cron diseases other fibro, others types of neuro and auto immune diseases depending on co infections .. just like in hiv/AIDS viral load an co infection can accelerate the disease.. coinsidently many of the herpes viruses hhv6, cmv, hsv-1, ebv exactly as it happens on CFS.... cfs( CFIDS) is an immune adquiered deficiency with out a doubt!!!!
gov know this clearly...
but from our underlaying immune deficiency there is many other diseases and type of cancer.. that generate trillion dollars in revenue every year.. expousing that its not what we all thought and that its the result of impaired immune system low immunity nk cell funtion will change forever what humanity thing about diseases...
trust me the truth its some were in btwn my words..
no other explanation to so many years of missleading this disease... if you think 30 million people with aids its a world crisis! think about 50 times that amount 300-400 million people most still healthy carriers developing all this cancers and auto-neuro immune disease as the result of the low immunity do to retroviral infection.
 
I just think retroviruses in cfs needs further research . Until they know the exact cause i dont think any avenue of research should be avoided .

There seems to be something underlying causing immune suppression and allowing infections to reactivate. Research has shown this to happen in a large proportion of cfsme patients . Its possible there may be another group with autoimmune tendencies which may be rituximab responders.
impaired innate immune system, low nk cell funtion , low cd56 bright signaling ( vital for immune response) this cause he adaptive immune system to kick in with cytokines storm when pathogen are already in organs and pritheral& central nervous system causing this massive inflamation..
" retroviruses 100%"
 

Not dead yet!

Well-Known Member
impaired innate immune system, low nk cell funtion , low cd56 bright signaling ( vital for immune response) this cause he adaptive immune system to kick in with cytokines storm when pathogen are already in organs and pritheral& central nervous system causing this massive inflamation..
" retroviruses 100%"


Two things recently in my life support this and the involvement (though not causality) of Lyme type "MSIDS" illness. First, I took myself off of all pain meds in the past two months and it was because my pain was getting vague and yet persistent. No doctor could diagnose that kind f thing. So I stopped. My drugs were masking a pain in my liver area. It became constant like a stab through my body directly through the liver. I will have CT results soon I hope, I went to get one today.

The inflammation when I was off the drugs was insane, I couldn't even think straight enough to remember whether it was lunchtime or dinner time. However, now that I'm back on the celebrex, etc, I can think more clearly than before. I'm wondering if the drugs themselves were hurting my liver's ability to function or even fight something off. During the fight though, I was practically delirious, and it was not due to withdrawal, that passed in the first month. Now I'm back to the masked pain, which just feels like pressure.

It's so easy to mask pain and inflammation and then deny it exists at all.

Second, I've mentioned before I'm reading a book called "How can I get better?" (Author Dr. Horowitz). I used to live in the town where he practices today. There was an excellent health food store there before the Whole Foods chain killed them all. I'm really not surprised that the area produced a leading edge clinic for "MSIDS" which is a term for Lyme-associated illnesses. The one I suspect in myself the most is Babesia, but I'm by no means finished reading. His description of what it takes in proper application of antibiotics and antiparasite medications to kill these things flies directly in the face of the current paradigm of not using such things because "it will cause resistance."

The fact is, whenever I am prescribed such things in a regular setting anymore, they give me the weakest one, and they give it to me for less than 10 days anymore. 20 years ago, they'd have given me the strongest one, and insisted I take it for a full 10 days, and they wouldn't have trusted any fancy time release, they'd have made me take it 3 or 4 times a day. So I think the "resistance" issue is self created by standard medicine as well. It started suspiciously right at the same time as MRSA became endemic in hospitals (early 1990s).

At that time, Danish authorities came up with a couple of protocols to de-infect people who are carriers of MRSA, but it was not adopted and called "unnecessary." I guess they prefer to scare people and deny them needed drugs. Personally I'd rather have the peace of mind.

The trail of intentional infection of the public leads right back to anything deemed Public Policy. Instead of adopting precautionary measures, they repeatedly decide to be laissez-faire and then stick their heads in the sand when it's time to take responsibility, and clean up the mess. It's like a group of frat boys have taken over the regulatory agencies and they view us as important as kitchen cleanup.

I suggest that we seduce as many of them as possible. :D
 

Merida

Well-Known Member
@Not dead yet!
Please keep us informed about your liver. I have a pretty big hemangioma in mine, and these things can be painful. Mine is not. Also, porphryia can cause this kind of pain. Acute intermittent porphryia is hard to diagnose. I had a very dark red-brown urine about 4 months ago. Got even darker in sunlight. So, keep an eye on your urine. ( That doesn't sound right, but you know what I mean.:wacky: Now, my porphyria test was negative, but no one tested the dark urine, only clear urine a week later. Why ? Why ? Why?

Interesting that these funny organisms, like Babesia, like Chlamnydophilia pneumonia, can cause liver pain and cause porphyria. Yes, I am just listened to a Dr. Horowitz lecture. I like this guy !! More and more I think we are all infected - with something unusual, and maybe not the same thing. Garth Nicolson is another person to check out. He also thinks we are infected.

Oh my.
 

Merida

Well-Known Member
@Not dead yet!
Just a note. Reread your comment. Think you are right on. Intentionally infected. Yes. Wow. I had MRSA sores on chest last year. Took 2 months to clear. I worked with all kinds of pathogens in the 1970s as a clinical diagnostic microbiologist at large hospital. We tracked staph infections. They were bad news, but NOTHING like MRSA. Intuitively think this bug was engineered somewhere. Would love to spend time sharing info. Hugs to All.
 

Not dead yet!

Well-Known Member
Don't know ?? Anyone??? I am heading for the Retroviral Camp. But what if it is even more complex? My son at age 5 ( 1986) had definite EBV, but not elevated monocytes. Did someone insert retroviral genes into EBV, or the reverse????? EBV was certainly used in research with viruses with the potential to carry genes into the cell nucleus/ genome.


I think HHV6 is definitely a retrovirus, despite it being named a "Herpes" virus. There is a foundation to study its wide range of effects.

About my liver, I posted some more information here:
https://www.healthrising.org/forums...s-with-liver-health-improvement-choline.5509/

My current treatment is not suitable for vegetarians. Liver has massive amounts of choline compared to any fruit or veg. However, you can probably find a vegan version of purified choline from Cauliflower or any veg that has a relatively high amount. My instincts say to avoid those veggies if you suspect SIBO and find a practitioner who will treat you for SIBO first. As the articles I quote say, gut bacteria can use choline as a food too, thus depleting your stores as the bacteria farm thrives.

I keep having a hankering for fish liver. I might end up going fishing for just that one foodstuff. Back in the day, it was a stew ingredient and we spiced it so hot you wouldn't taste a thing. :hilarious:
 

Merida

Well-Known Member
@Not dead yet!
Thank you! Yes, I have been exposed to HHV6. We know that there is research on using EBV to transfer genes to DNA in the nucleus, so ...
I think the retroviruses are now defined as having the enzyme reverse transcriptase? Whereas the Herpes viruses do not have this. But, this may be just a technicality in the viral nomenclature? Both groups can enter the nucleus and insert viral genes in out DNA?????
 

Not dead yet!

Well-Known Member
@Not dead yet!
Thank you! Yes, I have been exposed to HHV6. We know that there is research on using EBV to transfer genes to DNA in the nucleus, so ...
I think the retroviruses are now defined as having the enzyme reverse transcriptase? Whereas the Herpes viruses do not have this. But, this may be just a technicality in the viral nomenclature? Both groups can enter the nucleus and insert viral genes in out DNA?????

I was fascinated by viruses from the first moment I learned about them in high school. Alive, yet not alive. How can it not make a person think? Of course back then I had no idea I'd be quite this close and personal with one. LOL

My first career choice was biology research, before computers and IT took over everything and I was pressed into service doing that because I could. If I'd stayed, I'm sure viruses is what I'd be doing. Especially now.

However, it's a long time since I did any reading on them beyond an undergrad textbook. Sometimes I think the purpose of college is to show you what's missing in textbooks and how much you don't know yet.

Well that's why it's hard for me to understand the hubris of the average GP doctor who tells patients to 'go home and lose weight" instead of helping them with their metabolic problems. I hope that in the far future a history book will correct the record. I won't be alive to care though, and I want my life back now.
 
I think HHV6 is definitely a retrovirus, despite it being named a "Herpes" virus. There is a foundation to study its wide range of effects.

About my liver, I posted some more information here:
https://www.healthrising.org/forums...s-with-liver-health-improvement-choline.5509/

My current treatment is not suitable for vegetarians. Liver has massive amounts of choline compared to any fruit or veg. However, you can probably find a vegan version of purified choline from Cauliflower or any veg that has a relatively high amount. My instincts say to avoid those veggies if you suspect SIBO and find a practitioner who will treat you for SIBO first. As the articles I quote say, gut bacteria can use choline as a food too, thus depleting your stores as the bacteria farm thrives.

I keep having a hankering for fish liver. I might end up going fishing for just that one foodstuff. Back in the day, it was a stew ingredient and we spiced it so hot you wouldn't taste a thing. :hilarious:
jajaja you sound like Karen Lambert, she believe that hhv6 is a retrovirus causing Cfs and aids like disease..
Im not sure if its a retrovirus or the exact cause, but for sure all this viruses share certein type of protein in their composition that allow them to stay in the host for life look at HIV to, also hhv-6 cmv can help hiv to develope AIDS, to speed up replicationof hiv and entering the cell..
To me
they are all lab made.
 
I have not read it and I am not moved by her army of spammers that are supporting her and IMO they are lemmings.
what are you talking about?
who are you to speak that way??
we all know how the gov works and how much curruption there is up there at those levels.
mikovits is a true worrior risking her life out there fighting a monster, she is no conspirancy theorie she and Ruscceti are real science the rest we know what its!!
you know what its???
same BS they have use to cover up ME/CFS, to obscure me/cfs mi make the world believe we were just crazy lazy people making things up...
Sorry but a blind person can see that me/cfs is an infectious disease a real cronic disease just like aids or Ms...
I have always said " behind our illness it lays a pathogen responsible for many other conditions including cancer, look every new study including this cytokines from stanford show a high tumor necrosis in most of us.. we me/cfs are the cronic part of the desease...
that's the reason they have cover this up for decades.
everything Mikovits say makes perfect sense...
 

Not dead yet!

Well-Known Member
I would really like to see her research continued honestly instead of deceptively. Whether by her or by others, I don't mind which one. Probably she'd be happy to see the work continue whether she was part of it or not. I think she has been on the side of truth (Is there another? - quoting Lennier in B5 tv show). And it's the reactivity of the establishment against her work that stands out to people.

Until a credible continuation of her work is carried out, it will continue to be interesting to people. I mean, really, even Bluebeard's wife eventually opened the forbidden door. It was poor reasoning if they thought they could end her work this way. Human nature will not allow locked doors to persist. Even if it is a dry hole, people will dig it open again eventually, just to be sure that they weren't duped.

OTOH, I happen to believe she was on to something.
 

Zapped

Well-Known Member
I would really like to see her research continued honestly instead of deceptively. Whether by her or by others, I don't mind which one. Probably she'd be happy to see the work continue whether she was part of it or not. I think she has been on the side of truth (Is there another? - quoting Lennier in B5 tv show). And it's the reactivity of the establishment against her work that stands out to people.

Until a credible continuation of her work is carried out, it will continue to be interesting to people. I mean, really, even Bluebeard's wife eventually opened the forbidden door. It was poor reasoning if they thought they could end her work this way. Human nature will not allow locked doors to persist. Even if it is a dry hole, people will dig it open again eventually, just to be sure that they weren't duped.

OTOH, I happen to believe she was on to something.

Pursuant to reading this thread I bought the book, Plague last night and am nearly finished it. With the documentation therein and having read Dr. Byron Hyde’s books several years ago, I can’t help but believe Mikovits was/is on the right path. FWIW, I came upon some of her documentation, independently in other places over the years.

IMO, ‘Plague’ and/or Hyde’s textbook ought to be required reading for PWCs, at least for an understanding of the history of CFSME. (A few years ago Amazon.com had links to $2.00 library editions; maybe still? (I bought 6, for then future doctors, MD’s...)).

Initially concerned, even after due diligence, I now feel better about having switched over to ART last week - after enduring 30+ years of nada relief - from A...Z.
 
Last edited:

Get Our Free ME/CFS and FM Blog!



Forum Tips

Support Our Work

DO IT MONTHLY

HEALTH RISING IS NOT A 501 (c) 3 NON-PROFIT

Shopping on Amazon.com For HR

Latest Resources

Top