A fibromyalgia doctor just gave the thumbs up to ketamine. So did the past director of the National Institute of Mental Health.
They both think ketamine or rather drugs based on it could be the cat’s meow for pain and depression. But ketamine also recently rapidly improved fatigue in a study as well and is being studied in cancer fatigue.
Check out a most interesting drug in
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OMG, What do they think we are? Horses now. I have M.E, and right now I am in a great deal of pain, as my medication is not working for my pain. When I read this I thought to myself, just how will they do it. How do they know that people won’t overdose on it? There are a lot of questions that will need to be answered before anyone takes any.
I really don’t know what to say Georgina…. No, doctors don’t think people are horses. They’re trying to help people who are in severe pain who have run out of options. Ketamine is a legitimate option for people in severe pain.
How will they do it? They’ll do it like they’ll do any other drug – they’ll prescribe it in a certain amount and they’ll warn about taking too much. Actually since Ketamine is usually infused people will get what they will get.
Ketamine has been used in human medicine for a long time. Safe dosages are known and its a great drug for acute pain and certain procedures as well as used in a general anaesthetic.
A few yrs ago j read a study on doses used to treat depression, they wete extremely low from memory and probably not effective for acute pain issues.
I think it will atleast be closely monitored by drs in hospital to start with.
Its commonly used around the world in several paramedic services to treat injuries not responding to other traditional pain killer like morphine.
When you get an intravenous infusion of ketamine, an anesthesiologist or nurse anesthetist takes your weight and basis your dose on your weight. They should be checking on you every 5 minutes during your infusion. If there are any issues they can quickly slow down the administration of the drug. You are conscious during the process, so you will know whether you are doing okay or if the infusion becomes
The amount of ketamine given for the treatment of anxiety and depression is 1/10th the amount given in anesthesia. The drug has been used for anesthesia for about 50 years, so anesthesiologists are very familiar with the nature of the drug and how people respond.
Right now the going rate for an infusion is about $600. Any higher, and they are price gouging.
I didn’t finish my sentence, “so you will know whether you are doing okay or if the infusion experience becomes too intense.” Most people’s experience during a ketamine infusion is pleasant. My last infusion became too intense so I had the nurse anesthetist slow down the IV. They can also administer anti nausea medicine beforehand and a benzodiazepine if you experience too much anxiety (there rarely is any problem with isolated use of benzos and it will not interfere with the ketamine. It only appears that the brains of long time benzo users, particularly in high doses, seem to respond less or not at all to ketamine).
Dear one in so much pain, I am sorry for the pain. Give this a try if offered. Ask if it is not offered . A nurse friend of mine has had life altering pain since a work accident 12 yrs ago. This medication is what gets her through the weeks. She goes to a clinic for the IV Ketamine then uses regular pain pills by mouth until the next scheduled ketamine. Before the ketamine she had asked me to help her plan her funeral ‘
I am not tired. I am not depressed. I hurt.. Hydrocodone is what helps. I have been on it for five years I don’t abuse it it keeps me fictional. I believe it is big pharma that wants to make money off of people in pain. That is inhumane. You don’t care it’d all about the mighty dollar.
Ketamine is a very old drug and therefore has no patent protection. So big pharma is not making big money off this drug. I would be very cautious of altered derivatives of ketamine that big pharmaceutical companies like Johnson and Johnson are developing. Like any new drug, we really don’t know anything about short or long term side effects. As we all know the FDA can clear a drug as safe, and then class action law suits start popping up years later, and the FDA begins sending out warnings. Although we don’t know the long term effects of intravenous ketamine, it has been used widely for many years in anesthesia, and there appears to be some profile of its safety.
From what I have read from posts from a number people who have used intravenous ketamine on an intermittent basis to treat anxiety and depression is that the more infusions they get, the less often they need to return for another infusion. It seems, if anything, intravenous ketamine lends itself to independence rather than dependence on the drug.
Intravenous ketamine appears very promising for the treatment of depression (including bipolar depression), anxiety, chronic pain, and perhaps me/cfs. However, Ketamine is not suitable for people with schizophrenia, and it appears to be contraindicated for people with severe heart conditions.
I had 3 intravenous infusions of ketamine last week to treat anxiety and depression that have dramatically worsened since I have been on Klonopin (a benzodiazepine sedative class of drug) for the past 2 years (I’m currently working with a physician tapering off Klonopin using an oil based liquid compound of the drug).
I did not think that I would respond to the ketamine because many clinicians have noted that chronic users of benzodiazpines tend not to respond at all or to a lesser degree. The infusions did have a positive effect on anxiety (including the physical symptoms of anxiety – body tension, physical agitation, heart palpitations – all symptoms that began after 1 month of use of Klonopin) as well as depression and energy levels. However it is clear the sedative effect of the Klonopin is working in the other direction for me. I am intent on getting more infusions after I’ve completed my 30 week taper off Klonopin. Ketamine may also play a helpful role in my withdrawal from Klonopin.
One ketamine clinic located in Boston goes as far as to urine screen patients to ensure they do not have any benzo metabolites in their system to give the ketamine it’s best chance to work. Other clinics will give it a try anyway.
Regarding chronic use of benzos:
One psychiatrist who had been with the VA hospital for 20 years told me that of his first 10 years there they were getting patients hooked on benzos, and the second 10 years they were trying to get patients off benzos. They learned that in most cases long term use of benzos leads to worsening anxiety, depression, and sleep.
I go at length to discuss this because (1) chronic benzo users should first consider tapering off before receiving intravenous ketamine (if they can manage to wait), and (2) since in many cases daily use of mind altering drugs lends itself to tolerance and dependency, intermittent infusions of intravenous ketamine (once every few weeks or months) appears safer and more effective than daily administration of an oral or intranasal form of the drug.
So far clinicians have not noticed any tolerance or dependency issues with intermittent administration of intravenous ketamine. Plus the IV form of ketamine is by far the most bioavailable.
Intravenous ketamine appears to have great potential for all the conditions Cort discusses especially for people sensitive to the side effects of medications. After receiving an infusion of ketamine, the effects wear off very quickly. And if you respond to it, you get a therapeutic benefit that endures long after the drug has been cleared from your system.
Hi, so are you saying the ketamine made you more anxious because of the klonopin? I have been on 0.125mg for maybe 10 years. My Paxil quit working and now I’ve gone up to 1 mg since July of 2015. I’m thinking of doing the treatments because I’m have horrendous anxiety coming off of Paxil. Do you think the ketamine is a bad idea for me?
In an article about the “glutamatergic” theory of schizophrenia, it says,
” psychotomimetic agents such as phencyclidine (PCP) and ketamine induce psychotic symptoms and neurocognitive disturbances similar to those of schizophrenia by blocking neurotransmission at N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA)-type glutamate receptors.”
How will/would doctors know ahead of time who would, or who would not, develop psychotic symptoms nad neruocognitive disturbances?
Although still in the early stages in terms of understanding long term side effects, the amount of intravenous ketamine administered in a clinical setting is a small fraction of the amount used by those abusing it recreationally. Additionally, this much smaller dose administered in a clinical setting is dripped slowly in an IV as opposed to ingested all at once as those who use it recreationally.
Again, ketamine does not appear suitable for daily use and is contraindicated for people with schizophrenia.
Certainly contraindicated for people with schizophrenia but there is increasing evidence that daily use can be effective for some patients suffering from chronic severe pain conditions and treatment resistant depression,without major side effects or issues with dependence. For example look at the work of Varun Jaitly an English pain physician who has been treating patients with low daily doses of sublingual ketamine for up to 15 years without major problems. Further information can be found in the recently released book “Ketamine for Depression.”
Yes. Dr. Jay Goldstein had ketamine in his cocktail. I’m pretty sure it was administered sublingually. I recently read about him and he did trials that found ketamine to be the best treatment for chronic pain and Neurontin to be second best.
Ketamine has been a miracle for me. I have fibromyalgia/chronic fatigue, severe migraines and depression. Since getting ketamine infusions approximately every 6 weeks, I have 90% improvement in all symptoms. I was afraid I was becoming disabled and would soon be unable to work. I was having at least 5 migraines a month. I have had only one or low grade migraines in the past year. It has also helped me cope with perimenopause symptoms.
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OMG, What do they think we are? Horses now. I have M.E, and right now I am in a great deal of pain, as my medication is not working for my pain. When I read this I thought to myself, just how will they do it. How do they know that people won’t overdose on it? There are a lot of questions that will need to be answered before anyone takes any.
I really don’t know what to say Georgina…. No, doctors don’t think people are horses. They’re trying to help people who are in severe pain who have run out of options. Ketamine is a legitimate option for people in severe pain.
How will they do it? They’ll do it like they’ll do any other drug – they’ll prescribe it in a certain amount and they’ll warn about taking too much. Actually since Ketamine is usually infused people will get what they will get.
Ketamine has been used in human medicine for a long time. Safe dosages are known and its a great drug for acute pain and certain procedures as well as used in a general anaesthetic.
A few yrs ago j read a study on doses used to treat depression, they wete extremely low from memory and probably not effective for acute pain issues.
I think it will atleast be closely monitored by drs in hospital to start with.
Its commonly used around the world in several paramedic services to treat injuries not responding to other traditional pain killer like morphine.
When you get an intravenous infusion of ketamine, an anesthesiologist or nurse anesthetist takes your weight and basis your dose on your weight. They should be checking on you every 5 minutes during your infusion. If there are any issues they can quickly slow down the administration of the drug. You are conscious during the process, so you will know whether you are doing okay or if the infusion becomes
The amount of ketamine given for the treatment of anxiety and depression is 1/10th the amount given in anesthesia. The drug has been used for anesthesia for about 50 years, so anesthesiologists are very familiar with the nature of the drug and how people respond.
Right now the going rate for an infusion is about $600. Any higher, and they are price gouging.
I didn’t finish my sentence, “so you will know whether you are doing okay or if the infusion experience becomes too intense.” Most people’s experience during a ketamine infusion is pleasant. My last infusion became too intense so I had the nurse anesthetist slow down the IV. They can also administer anti nausea medicine beforehand and a benzodiazepine if you experience too much anxiety (there rarely is any problem with isolated use of benzos and it will not interfere with the ketamine. It only appears that the brains of long time benzo users, particularly in high doses, seem to respond less or not at all to ketamine).
Appreciate the information Stephen…
Dear one in so much pain, I am sorry for the pain. Give this a try if offered. Ask if it is not offered . A nurse friend of mine has had life altering pain since a work accident 12 yrs ago. This medication is what gets her through the weeks. She goes to a clinic for the IV Ketamine then uses regular pain pills by mouth until the next scheduled ketamine. Before the ketamine she had asked me to help her plan her funeral ‘
I am not tired. I am not depressed. I hurt.. Hydrocodone is what helps. I have been on it for five years I don’t abuse it it keeps me fictional. I believe it is big pharma that wants to make money off of people in pain. That is inhumane. You don’t care it’d all about the mighty dollar.
What exactly is inhumane? I don’t understand how not being tired or depressed matter as Ketamine is also, as the blog notes, used for pain…
Ketamine is a very old drug and therefore has no patent protection. So big pharma is not making big money off this drug. I would be very cautious of altered derivatives of ketamine that big pharmaceutical companies like Johnson and Johnson are developing. Like any new drug, we really don’t know anything about short or long term side effects. As we all know the FDA can clear a drug as safe, and then class action law suits start popping up years later, and the FDA begins sending out warnings. Although we don’t know the long term effects of intravenous ketamine, it has been used widely for many years in anesthesia, and there appears to be some profile of its safety.
From what I have read from posts from a number people who have used intravenous ketamine on an intermittent basis to treat anxiety and depression is that the more infusions they get, the less often they need to return for another infusion. It seems, if anything, intravenous ketamine lends itself to independence rather than dependence on the drug.
Intravenous ketamine appears very promising for the treatment of depression (including bipolar depression), anxiety, chronic pain, and perhaps me/cfs. However, Ketamine is not suitable for people with schizophrenia, and it appears to be contraindicated for people with severe heart conditions.
The wackiest comments are just above.
Long time reader, first time commenting.
I had 3 intravenous infusions of ketamine last week to treat anxiety and depression that have dramatically worsened since I have been on Klonopin (a benzodiazepine sedative class of drug) for the past 2 years (I’m currently working with a physician tapering off Klonopin using an oil based liquid compound of the drug).
I did not think that I would respond to the ketamine because many clinicians have noted that chronic users of benzodiazpines tend not to respond at all or to a lesser degree. The infusions did have a positive effect on anxiety (including the physical symptoms of anxiety – body tension, physical agitation, heart palpitations – all symptoms that began after 1 month of use of Klonopin) as well as depression and energy levels. However it is clear the sedative effect of the Klonopin is working in the other direction for me. I am intent on getting more infusions after I’ve completed my 30 week taper off Klonopin. Ketamine may also play a helpful role in my withdrawal from Klonopin.
One ketamine clinic located in Boston goes as far as to urine screen patients to ensure they do not have any benzo metabolites in their system to give the ketamine it’s best chance to work. Other clinics will give it a try anyway.
Regarding chronic use of benzos:
One psychiatrist who had been with the VA hospital for 20 years told me that of his first 10 years there they were getting patients hooked on benzos, and the second 10 years they were trying to get patients off benzos. They learned that in most cases long term use of benzos leads to worsening anxiety, depression, and sleep.
I go at length to discuss this because (1) chronic benzo users should first consider tapering off before receiving intravenous ketamine (if they can manage to wait), and (2) since in many cases daily use of mind altering drugs lends itself to tolerance and dependency, intermittent infusions of intravenous ketamine (once every few weeks or months) appears safer and more effective than daily administration of an oral or intranasal form of the drug.
So far clinicians have not noticed any tolerance or dependency issues with intermittent administration of intravenous ketamine. Plus the IV form of ketamine is by far the most bioavailable.
Intravenous ketamine appears to have great potential for all the conditions Cort discusses especially for people sensitive to the side effects of medications. After receiving an infusion of ketamine, the effects wear off very quickly. And if you respond to it, you get a therapeutic benefit that endures long after the drug has been cleared from your system.
Thank you
Great first comment Stephen! 🙂 Thanks!
Hi, so are you saying the ketamine made you more anxious because of the klonopin? I have been on 0.125mg for maybe 10 years. My Paxil quit working and now I’ve gone up to 1 mg since July of 2015. I’m thinking of doing the treatments because I’m have horrendous anxiety coming off of Paxil. Do you think the ketamine is a bad idea for me?
In an article about the “glutamatergic” theory of schizophrenia, it says,
” psychotomimetic agents such as phencyclidine (PCP) and ketamine induce psychotic symptoms and neurocognitive disturbances similar to those of schizophrenia by blocking neurotransmission at N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA)-type glutamate receptors.”
How will/would doctors know ahead of time who would, or who would not, develop psychotic symptoms nad neruocognitive disturbances?
Although still in the early stages in terms of understanding long term side effects, the amount of intravenous ketamine administered in a clinical setting is a small fraction of the amount used by those abusing it recreationally. Additionally, this much smaller dose administered in a clinical setting is dripped slowly in an IV as opposed to ingested all at once as those who use it recreationally.
Again, ketamine does not appear suitable for daily use and is contraindicated for people with schizophrenia.
Certainly contraindicated for people with schizophrenia but there is increasing evidence that daily use can be effective for some patients suffering from chronic severe pain conditions and treatment resistant depression,without major side effects or issues with dependence. For example look at the work of Varun Jaitly an English pain physician who has been treating patients with low daily doses of sublingual ketamine for up to 15 years without major problems. Further information can be found in the recently released book “Ketamine for Depression.”
Sublingual ketamine – I didn’t know of that. I wonder if that was what Goldstein used in his “resurrection cocktail”?
Yes. Dr. Jay Goldstein had ketamine in his cocktail. I’m pretty sure it was administered sublingually. I recently read about him and he did trials that found ketamine to be the best treatment for chronic pain and Neurontin to be second best.
Ketamine has been a miracle for me. I have fibromyalgia/chronic fatigue, severe migraines and depression. Since getting ketamine infusions approximately every 6 weeks, I have 90% improvement in all symptoms. I was afraid I was becoming disabled and would soon be unable to work. I was having at least 5 migraines a month. I have had only one or low grade migraines in the past year. It has also helped me cope with perimenopause symptoms.
Congratulations! and thanks for passing that on 🙂